Twelfth Post!

[hoisinsauce]

POST NAMER TBC-- work harder, meme!

Welcome back, anyway! Chat fandom, media, creative things, weirdness from around the net, funny stuff, anything! Meme awaits!

(start a comment thread by replying to this post)

 

Comments

Re: How's Life? - Filia 2025

[(Anonymous)]

Filia's statement on discogate:

https://nitter.net/K_IngalaSmith/status/1977455528025444845#m

Have heard this refers to Jean Hatchet and Aja.

Filia still haven't said anything publicly about having allowed fans of terrorists to speak. I hope there's more going on behind the scenes. They need to get serious about it imo.

Re: How's Life? - Filia 2025

[(Anonymous)]

(also lol you know the situation is bad when any Aja comes out sympathetic.)

Re: How's Life? - Filia 2025

[(Anonymous)]

And similarly, I respect Karen Ingala Smith, but as I'm trying to establish the truth of what happened, I see she's retweeting one of the many women I have filed as an idiot antisemite, who amplifies obvious lies. So that makes me question her judgement. *sigh*

Re: How's Life? - Filia 2025

[(Anonymous)]

Some good convos on this thread:

https://nitter.net/AudreySuffolk/status/1977259595531010064#m

I agree on the "nettle to be grasped" comment. There's no way of pleasing everyone, so they need to pick which women to alienate.

(I really enjoyed Filia the time I went, so it's a shame to see all this, but also a situation like this was predictable, and they don't seem to have adequately prepared. So I feel... dull annoyance and sadness? I hope I'm wrong because right now I think it looks like they'll choose to alienate the women I'd prefer to keep around!)

Re: How's Life? - Filia 2025

[(Anonymous)]

Or possibly DJ Lippy and Aja got banned? But iirc Jean Hatchet said she got banned? Which makes 3?

Not followed the discofight details that closely; I care about the overall situation but none of the banned women are women whose work I like to read much.

Re: How's Life? - Filia 2025

[(Anonymous)]

And yes, KJK still seems to be hoping the whole conference gets destroyed over it, rather than hoping it gets adjusted and repaired. Apparently her daughter's in hospital with sepsis, which is likely contributing to the rancour. Her posts about the shitness of medical care ring very true to me, and I have a lot of sympathy there. Shame about some of her other posts. As always.

I am mostly hoping I can keep liking the feminists I do like. Plz world.

Re: How's Life? - Filia 2025

[(Anonymous)]

Karen Ingala Smith's version of events:

https://nitter.net/K_IngalaSmith/status/1977745892141625714#m

Leaving out who threw the first drink does seem like a big omission. XD Though if you wanna stan terrorists, as Masoud seems to have been going for with the Leila Khaled Autumn Collection, you'd think you'd be all about that getting-unexpectedly-assaulted-in-public lifestyle. Seems a bit weird to be like "planejacking is cool with me, but throwing a drink is beyond the pale".

Re: How's Life? - Filia 2025

[(Anonymous)]

SD

JH claims it's a lie and she'll publish the footage when she gets it. More news at 5! 🕵️‍♀️

Re: How's Life? - Filia 2025

[(Anonymous)]

SD

Anyway yeah from a distance it seems like a number of these feminists are doing exaaaactly the same thing as the TRAs, where they pose with symbols of violence as a game and goad women with it, without caring if it triggers anyone. I feel bad for the organisers having to handle the mess, but I think they needed to be firmer on it earlier.

Re: How's Life? - Filia 2025

[(Anonymous)]

SD

Also there's a good thread from Bea Jaspert on why the opening talk was inappropriate, but personally I think, as with TRAs, people suddenly pretend not to understand things on this one, and I'm skeptical of explanations having any impact. I think the women who believe RG tried to lead a chant as a way to push some women *out* are correct. I don't think it's the behaviour of someone who cares and who is trying to improve things. Maybe Filia are a bit naive on this one. I've heard some of them were furious about the opening comments because they'd asked RG not to bring it up, ahead of time, and I get not wanting to air dirty laundry loudly, but right now I really can't tell if they're taking a breather or if they just don't see the same pattern/danger some of us are seeing. I'm a bit concerned at the kneejerk "it's just right-wingers making trouble" from some of the old hands. Nah, there are women genuinely wondering whether they should write the conference off from now on.

Re: How's Life? - Filia 2025

[(Anonymous)]

SD

Filia still not commented afaik. Though am getting irritated at the posts from longtimers who don't seem to understand the problem and are just going "we all have different politics". I mentioned it earlier; I got chills reading this:

https://nitter.net/hogotheforsaken/status/1977787105490158069#m

I remember that group! I think they had a stall at Filia when I went. It's not about "politics"...

Re: How's Life? - Filia 2025

[(Anonymous)]

Dans who were there, Filia have sent out a statement suggesting they’re taking it very seriously: check ur email.

Commissioning an independent investigation into their processes, alerting the charity commission over the whole Hamas stuff, and convening a series of meetings.

Re: How's Life? - Filia 2025

[(Anonymous)]

DD

Had a read (too lazy to open the email I use for their stuff, but pasted tweets abound!). I'm glad they're taking it seriously, and it should piss off the maoists! :) Amazing (not really amazing) how many twitter people seem to think a charity's formal statement is the place to start apologising to random individuals for this or that. They literally say in the statement they still need to establish what happened. Some people always seem to really want anyone who organises anything to be villains.

Re: How's Life? - Filia 2025

[(Anonymous)]

SD

"sounds like lawyers wrote it"

Yeah no shit an actual charity with actual obligations would involve lawyers in the process, yes

Re: How's Life? - Filia 2025

[(Anonymous)]

twv clowns not taking it well, lol:

https://nitter.net/loveologian/status/1979547604645269922#m

Pardis retweeted it.

And I agree on "different traditions"! Must be very confusing to be them, right now. I'd initially assumed they were lying about being "invited", but if they were, whoever invited them should've also thought about what a twattish thing it was to do TO these idiots.

Re: How's Life? - Filia 2025

[(Anonymous)]

Wpuk co-founder decides to pour oil on the flames:

https://nitter.net/TybilAlper/status/1979962728446828792#m

Idk why she thought this would help anyone at this moment, tbh.

Re: How's Life? - Filia 2025

[(Anonymous)]

Filia have commented... on who was and wasn't removed from the disco. 🙃 Filia, in the gentlest possible way, I don't *care*. Some random on twitter says she asked about the part that actually matters (ie: the bit where they invited an insane antisemite speaker who broke UK terror law while in the country), and was told the trustees are discussing it and it'll take a couple of weeks.

Re: How's Life? - Filia 2025

[(Anonymous)]

Actually, sorry, they only spoke on who *wasn't* removed from the disco. Not who was. /peDANtry

Re: How's Life? - Filia 2025

[(Anonymous)]

Video of some disco cringe:

https://nitter.net/JeanHatchet/status/1978530445596795191#m

Idk maybe this was all actually a genius plot to put young people off the cause. Everyone's always saying that, to put young people off transing, older women need to be visibly into it. Maybe these women are playing 12D chess.

Re: How's Life? - Filia 2025

[(Anonymous)]

Al Jazeera tomorrow: "Mossad Agents Masquerading as World's Worst Dancers Infiltrate Women's Conference!!!"

(Actually tho I've heard there have been big changes at al jazeera.)

Re: How's Life? - Filia 2025

[(Anonymous)]

Various online feminists are saying JH was only there to cause trouble and doesn't really care about antisemitism. But I don't think the issue here is the motives of someone on twitter, and they don't seem to have any response re: the fucked up behaviour she's objecting to. They've claimed she's lying but not said about what, and there's video footage of the part I actually care about. So idk about anyone's motivations for making a fuss, but saying it's just rw women causing trouble seems weird when it's not like rw women gave the talks or invited the guests or brought the flags in.

Re: How's Life? - Filia 2025

[(Anonymous)]

>the trustees are discussing it and it'll take a couple of weeks.

I think this is reasonable. They need to properly unpick what happened, work out where lines should be on various things, and make sure they’re not libelling anyone.

They get a huge amount of shit for every woman or group they exclude, and for pretty much every one they include. That must make it difficult to tell, if people are complaining about someone who was included being beyond the pale, whether people are being reasonable. Some people were complaining about including women in hijabs on any panels, and excluding them would obviously have seriously limited the voices you could hear from on some issues: Julie Bindel had Zlahka Ahmed on her panel, to talk about Rotherham and similar, and that discussion would have been poorer without her. Bindel also had to respond quite powerfully to a member of the audience who thought ethnicity should never be mentioned, even after Ahmed had talked about the ways that she and the women she helped had to work around cultural issues.

I imagine people thought they were inviting fiesty young women with a lot of energy to be part of panels that had a lot of other, more experienced women on. They were trying to represent different strands and get women talking to each other. From seeing their behaviour when they were there, obviously these women were not up for that and we can see reasons to have always suspected that would be the case, so there will have to be a lot of internal discussion of how this happened and what should happen next.

I think it is reasonable for them to give holding statements until they’ve properly discussed things.

Re: How's Life? - Filia 2025

[(Anonymous)]

> I imagine people thought they were inviting fiesty young women with a lot of energy to be part of panels that had a lot of other, more experienced women on.

I think so, and one concern I have is that some older, trusted women vouched for them, having themselves seen their posts. I think their behaviour at the conference was cringe and stupid, but it's the stuff before the conference, online for all to see, that's worse. So I can imagine the Filia organisers themselves not being aware, but my worry is that someone *was*, and was pushing for these girls to be included.

And I also can't be completely confident right now that Filia *was* just oblivious to what they'd said. I mean, there was RRS making weirdass comments about the hostages, and afaik she's still their official spokesperson. So I'm like "did Filia a) not know that that team had posted neonazi shit? b) know what they posted but not understand the significance? c) know and understand and basically agree?" Like, do they actually understand that people see the red triangle like a swastika? (I suspect not, because I think they would have reacted differently to someone posting "I love hitler! 88!" and yet I think ironically people might have found that *less* offensive because it's just ridiculous at that point. Still not a *great* choice for a speaker! :'))

And yeah Filia has legal reasons to move slowly rather than rashly, but we've got Esmee's publication there saying it stands with TWV; right now apparently I can't trust respected women who've been working on feminist causes forever to have any semblance of judgement.

From a distance, it feels like they're in circles where antisemitism is normalised, so they don't see how this sticks out. They will have had attendees whose friends and families were murdered in the attack Sathi et al were celebrating online. If someone said "I love love love the BNP!!!", I think they'd drop that person, and the BNP haven't committed mass murder. But seems like they're much better at recognising racism when it comes from the right, and maybe not great at seeing this stuff from a distance.

So, yeah, I'm hoping Filia are just ignorant about the posts, buuut there is this double standard among the leftfems in general, which led to me stopping wanting to be involved in their groups. (Needless to say I have no interest in joining the rightwing groups either :D). When people support the antisemitic stuff it calls everything else they've worked on into question for me. I don't get the vibe Filia are taking this seriously enough, but that is just vibes. I hope to be wrong!

Re: How's Life? - Filia 2025

[(Anonymous)]

SD

(It was just honestly impressive how almost all the women whom I personally disliked but who had talked a good game about being leftwing feminists turned into full-on raving antisemites after oct 7th. I'd thought so many times, "This woman is a born antisemite... Aw, stop being mean, you don't know that". Turns out I did! And I would now wager the reason they oppose the far right is simply because they believe they themselves would be persecuted; I don't think they care about anyone else.)

Re: How's Life? - Filia 2025

[(Anonymous)]

They're claiming the ceo endorsed their bullshit, which I doubt:

https://nitter.net/BarbaraRich_law/status/1978877102960316514#m

Travel etc paid by a conference doesn't mean the organisers know everything you've tweeted, let alone agree. Being invited doesn't mean that, either. Some women in comments on OP seem ignorant about how conference speaking usually works (and oddly quick to believe these nutters!).

Still looks like a big fuckup on Filia's part.